Writing from a different language/culture than the characters

[ximeria.livejournal.com]

How do you imagine what goes on inside a Mountie's head? Or how do you get inside the mind of a Chicago Flatfoot with experimental hair style? Or even worse, how do you even begin to write Diefenbaker, when your native language isn't Wolf, let alone English?

Let's start off easy: Hello, my penname is Ximeria, to many people simply known as 'Xim'. I'm here to ponder a topic that should have made me run for the hills back in 2001 when I first started writing fanfic.

See, I was born, and I still live, in a small country in Scandinavia (Denmark for those who are geography nerds or simply curious). For those who don't know, the language here is Danish, not English. Location wise, we're half-way around the globe from Chicago (give or take a bit).

So, what am I yammering about? Let's just say there are a few things that can seriously pull the writing experience to a grinding halt.



SIZE (it does matter, don't let them tell you otherwise...)

Everything here is small. This means one obstacle in writing a setting in a city like Chicago, USA, is the SIZE issue (not THAT size, please, I know it's fun down here in the gutter, but let's keep this at a certain level, eh?). I meant the size of the city, the buildings... everything, really.

CULTURE (a pesky thing, but getting it wrong can ruin any story)

This is Western Europe, but it's NOT the same culture as the US (sometimes we forget, until we try to write fanfic, that is).

LANGUAGE (we should all have a little yellow fish in our ear...)

So, how should it be treated? Is it a barrier or a dirty advantage?

THE HOLY GRAIL (or maybe just a few pieces of advice I've picked up over time)

How to best work your way around aforementioned problems.

---

Size
aka. Think BIG.

Simple everyday things are not the same. When I think supermarket, I have these smaller local supermarkets. They're pretty small but they fulfill my needs. When I think mal, I think the shopping center here in Odense. It's big.

By Danish standards, that is. It's probably really small compared to American standards.

Furthermore, what's on the shelves in the US? More importantly, can I buy lube anywhere in Chicago at 3AM? (And doughnuts, sorry, Dief!)

Culture
because we're really not as alike as we sometimes think.

As an example, an American cop doesn't react as a Danish cop would. Nor do people in general. We're so used to American TV and movies, that we think we know how anyone would react, from the cops to the pimps on the streets. Don't ask me what's worse, leaning on what you know from your own place or basing it on the fiction you see on the screen?

Still, you take the idea and run with it. Right until you try to write it and someone points out that you've got it wrong...

Sometimes you just want to sit down and cry. You think you've got this kick ass story with a head kicking plot and killer lines. And then someone comes along and tells you that 'A Chicago cop would never do/say that.'

*lower lip trembles*

Language
My English teacher would cry if she only knew how I put my abilities to use...

I consider it a dirty advantage, really. Or rather, I've learned to view it that way. Back when I started out, I was told to not let anyone know that I was from a non-English speaking country. When you get "That's pretty good English for a Dane" thrown at you from someone who thinks Denmark is the capitol of Sweden, you either feel slightly defeated or you snort and tell them that your English a damned lot better than their AOL infested comment - no insult intended. I think I gave up on reading that 'feedback' I received, because the grammar scared me out of my mind. Though if that's all the feedback you get, instead of some comment on the story itself? It puts a dent in your joy. Sure, we say we write for our own sakes, but it still sucks when the feedback focuses on something like that instead of what you've put into it.

So where's the advantage?

Let me tell you a little secret. One of my favorite betas isn't English either. She's German. We got to talking at one point about why I found it more helpful to have her check my grammar on occasion, than an American or a Brit.

Well, if I tell you that the people who speak the worst Danish in terms or grammar are Danes, then I think you might get it. If it's a language you've learned because you had to/wanted to, then you're often more focused on doing it right. We're always sloppier with the language we grow up with (*shushes the peanut gallery of people who are militant about their language -- I'm talking about the majority*).

Holy Grail
A little word of advice, maybe even two...

So, how do you work your way around it all?

There's the language. Yes, it can feel like one heck of a barrier, but you know what? Try. I cringe when I re-read some of my really old stuff, but it has served as one thing. It's been an exercise and the more I've worked with it, the better I've become at it. The less I feel like the language difference trips me at inopportune times.

Apart from that, you work your way around it like you always do. It's no fun if the entire focus of your story ends up being on the grammar and wording instead of the actual plot.

In terms of cultural differences, and let's not even mention the layout of Chicago or Inuvik... Well, it's all research really. We have, at hand, the internet. You need to work up an ability for cutting the bull out and throwing it away, or you'll end up with a lot of useless nonsense. Really, you can look up just about anything and there are maps of EVERYTHING (even the moon! I mean, if you're doing an AU and you're... okay, never mind...)

Above all else... never forget that you're not alone. Due South isn't a dying fandom, nor does it seem to be shrinking. On the contrary, it seems to be growing every day. There are people from all around the world, Chicago too (not sure about Inuvik, though...)

So, how do you maneuver through Chicago without making too many blunders that would make any Chicagoan groan and shake their heads?

Ask. If you have a question, ask someone in the fandom. If they don't know it, they can point you in the right direction. There are several place online that are a huge help.

Don't know your way around the police districts? Don't know if there's an East Side or West Side in Chicago? Either search for a map or ask.

Betas are hard to come by, great betas are even harder to find, but if luck is with you, you get one who won't just take your sentences apart, but who'll also be a help in picking out silly mistakes that are rooted in cultural misunderstandings or language construction. Even better, use more than one beta reader. All those wonderful people out there each have an area that they're really good at. Some are research geniuses, some are grammar crunchers and some are just plain awesome.

And the best thing about the fandom? People are more than happy to help.

*hearts fandom*

--xim--


The Goodie Bag:
(Research links)

Chicagocrime.org
It's a bit morbid, but you get a good idea of what crimes are happening, but best of all? You get a map of the police districts.

dues_research
Anything you need to ask for? Locations, chronology, anything relating to the Due South fandom. Go here to ask for help. They also have a lot of links that are perfect for research.

sga_canada_help
Don't be fooled by the SGA in the name of this community. It's meant as a help when you're trying to write something Canadian. Not Due South specific, but they can still help.

ds_writers
Looking for a beta reader? Got a question for which you can't seem to find the answer? This is your place.

Comments

[nos4a2no9.livejournal.com]

I've been encountering these problems from the other direction: I'm from northern Canada and it's a little disorienting to read so many post-CotW stories written by Americans, Brits, Aussies and other Europeans (or other Canadians) set in a culture very few people are familiar with or have experienced first-hand. Some of the subtlies in culture, weather and common expression escape a lot of writers because there are little-to-no resources available on those aspects of life in northern Canada beyond municipal websites, a few books and the occaisonal blog. And, obviously, no one in the fandom would notice except me and perhaps troyswann.

I don't think it would be appropriate to correct authors (except in cases of grievous error or misrepresentation) because usually it's something small and hardly worth correcting, something that only a person native to the region would even pick up on. And I'd hate to niggle over tiny details when the story is excellent in every other way. Just as an example, one of the ds_aprilfools stories referenced my hometown (Fraser and Ray were living there) and I had mentioned that tidbit in my feedback for the story (which I loved). This made the author a little nervous because she hadn't expected anyone familiar with the area to be reading the story.

I suppose my question would be, would authors want me to comment on this material if it's only slightly incorrect? Or would my small niggling distract from how the story as a whole is operating? I know this would probably come down to individual preference and an author's commitment to realism vs. what would best serve the needs of the story, but how should those of us with first-hand experience to offer conduct ourselves when we notice small inconsistencies?

[sage]

oh god, if you wanted to put together a post on the mistakes you see made most frequently for this community, I would love you forever!! I spend so much time trying for a vague impression of accuracy, but researching something with so few sources is near impossible and so frustrating. Would you mind? It could be a separate feature, totally apart from the craft series.

[nos4a2no9.livejournal.com]

I'm such a dope - I've been wracking my brain trying to come up with something to offer this community and it never occured to me that people might, y'know, be interested in northern Canadian culture. /is pretty like whoah

I'd love to do this as part of the craft series: when would be a good time to post? I know you've contributors lined up for the next few weeks, so just slot me in and I'll whip something up.

[sage]

Okay, we could do this one of two ways. There's one person on deck as of now, so hopefully she'll post around midweek of next week. The following post should about a week after that. If that timeframe works for you, then YAY! It's yours!

BUT! If you're inspired and want to do something (*cough*now*cough*) sooner than that, then by all means! We can just make it a feature essay outside of the series.

I guess it mostly depends on how long you want to work on it. I don't know if you have a list of pet peeves on hand or if you want to spend a little bit of time gathering examples of mistakes...so truly, whichever works best for you. :D

And YAY! I can't wait!! I love setting and specific detail SO MUCH (as everyone knows because I go on and on and ON about it) and this is exactly what I've been hoping for! *twirls you*

[nos4a2no9.livejournal.com]

If you're okay making it a feature outside of the craftwork series, I'd like to put some time into the essay and gather some examples (from willing authors only, of course) and post it sometime before the end of May. Would that work?

[sage]

That works beautifully! Yay, I'm so excited! :D

And if you have questions about use of examples, just let me know. Offhand, I'd say that anonymous (common) generalizations are fine, but specific quotes should have author permission.

[ximeria.livejournal.com]

*laughs*
I can't even begin to imagine how I'd feel if I were Canadian and read the CotW stories.

There's a loaded question. I find it slightly off putting when I'm corrected during the writing process, at least if it's minor errors. However, I feel pretty much the same way if the correction comes after I've posted LOL. I have a general agreement with my beta readers -- I don't give them the story until I'm done with the first version of it. They don't get bits while I'm writing. Mostly because it breaks my writing flow if I have to go back and make corrections in the middle of the story.

That said, if a beta reader points out to me that there are errors that have to do with culture or similar obstacles, then I do want them. It's just easier, at least to me, to take those things into account when the skeleton of the story itself is done.

Would I want corrections? Absolutely. Though as you say, pointing out small flaws could be considered niggling in a bad way. However, to me, it would depend on how it's served. If it's all the comment you get, then I'd be annoyed with it, but if it's part of a comment with likes/dislikes of the story itself, then by all means, it is as welcome as any other kind of feedback.

[kill-claudio.livejournal.com]

I suppose my question would be, would authors want me to comment on this material if it's only slightly incorrect?

I'm probably going to regret saying this, but I am always happy to hear corrections. If it's really small, or I think it's a bit petty, I may not change it, but the next time I'm writing I will remember, and it will help.

Maybe it's something to do with the fact that I almost never look at one of my stories and think 'it's finished'. I look at it and think 'damn, the deadline's tomorrow', or maybe 'if I have to read this bloody thing one more time I will cry', but never 'oh look, I'm completely satisfied!'

[keerawa.livejournal.com]

Note to self: make nos4a2no9 or troyswann beta anythign set in Northern Canda. And, yes, please do let me know if you come across anything odd in my writing.